Rog i agree with you at some points, but don't tell me that the French the Dutch or the Germans think it can't happen to them...
In all of these countries the government is trying to prevent things like this..
Still the fact remains that things like this are hard to prevent because you don't know when and where it is happening and who could be responsible for this.

I think that most of the people here will know that it is not the muslims but the fanatic muslims...
I think that when something happens it is never a whole race or a whole country who did it...
It are always to fanatic people from a race or a country

also the Islam is not a bad thing, in fact the Islam is better then most other religions, still it are some fanatic people who read the Koran wrong, and the sad thing is that most of those fanatic people have a lot of might and they can tell what many other muslims must feel or do...

(this is a continuation of my last post, Hankyspanky beat me to having it join)


Is it real patriotism to defend your country when it wrong? I believe we need to look at all the wrongs committed and judge for ourselves where the blame for events lies. If my country is doing something I disagree with, it is my duty to try to stop it from doing that.

We may not all agree on anything, but a clear eyed view of the history of the past century should show us that politicians lie, armies destroy innocent lives and war solves nothing. Sometimes it is necessary for survival, but in the end it solves nothing, politicians still lie, soldiers kill innocent people and the world continues on its path to destruction.

The people I admire most try to change that with their brains, not their guns. Fight when you have to, but don't lie to yourself about what you are fighting for. If it is for oil and a particular way of life, at least admit it. Some people would rather be comfortable than to be honorable.

I fear our present government because they are totally committed to making sure that their rich pals don't lose a single penny. I don't honestly believe they have my best interests at heart. The rest of the world is learning to fear our government as well, they see us doing whatever we want because we have the power to do so.

When we are right, I am there to support that, when we are wrong, in my opinion, I will not be silenced by people who don't like to hear about their action's consequences.

We all reap what we sow. Using force ultimately leads to the destruction of those who use it. Yes, I think we should negotiate with anyone forever if it means innocent people will live. Perhaps we will see that cooperation will take us farther than competition. It's worth a try. It hasn't ever been tried yet to my knowledge.

Maybe we will find that Islamic people would respond to an honest dialog better than a slimy deal cooked up by the wealthy world owners?

I'm sorry about the Londoners killed. They didn't deserve it. The people in the Trade Center towers didn't deserve it either. The people who have been subjugated by dictators didn't deserve it. There are a lot of screwed up people running things all over the world.
We shouldn't elect them and we shouldn't support them. Time for a change.

Last Edited : Friday, 8 July 2005 - 06:07

Point 1:
I do not know what is the root of the problem, maybe I will never know ... but we all have to agree with something ... arabs countries are problematic as hell. Is it cultural, historical or who knows what, but it is a fact, they are problematic, whomever has dealt (lived) with arabs can vouch for this.

The other day I saw a photo that strung a chord very hard. It was a lady being decapitated in public for alleged sexual issues (not very sure, but I think it was for not being married and having sex or something like that) and the other side of the page was a picture of lambs, which for some reason or the other can't be slaugthered ... the message on top: This is right (the lady being beheaded) this is wrong. Curious isn't it.

When this cultural deviance on such large scale occurred???. When social values became so twisted that persons can be killed but animals ... well not because it is bad and God forbids it.

You go to your Halal meat shop to buy Islam-approved slaugthered meat, in which they pray before they kill the animal and they do it in all accordance to the law of God ... but for this lady nothing but public humilliation, torture and death. Tough to swallow and not digestible by me.

Women don't count, life outside their circle doesn't count, yet they are very religious. I do not know what kind of belif states that either person is worth half (or less) than another, or that it is OK to kill if they don't think like I do. What century are we on??? Can someone please remind me because I'm confused???.

That we allow this belive to move around in the world infestating yet more minds is a sin ... and f.u.c.k human rights (sorry but no other way to say it). This animals are not humans, they should be fence, caged, neutered and left there.

I happen to be just a few days ago with my kids where all this bomb s.h.i.t. happened, and belive me it is hard not to be prejudicious on the WHOLE arab community ... come on I don't see Mexican blowing up stuff here and there, I don't see Canadians self sacrificing themselves, I only see arabs, arabs and more arabs. Every day, every damned hour ... arabs.

I feel wrong by wanting them out the map, all of them. But belive me I would not mind. I know how they threat their women, I know how they threat their kids, why in the world do I expect them to threat me (or you) good, it is not in them.

When woman do not count in a society, and this retrograd man rule, you get this. To hell with them and their stupid machism, and also with their customs and all.

Point 2:
I firmly belive that goverment should not be tied to any religion at all, not any. Someone more wise than me already said: "To God what is for God, and to men what is for men". Politics and stuff for men, religion for God, they should be like oil and water, never meant to be mixed.

Catholisism proved in the middle-ages in Europe that this is very true, and that God-goverment are to the demise of people.

Islam-goberments suck big time, they blind the people with shady politics, and with religion propaganda. To hell with that also.

Point 3:
Now I vented my stress of my close encounter with terrorism, I feel better, hope you all don't mind, but I got me thinking.

Point 4:
Sorry to those arabs that I offend with this...but it is VERY hard for me to not be prejudicious.

And don't be hard to judge me. If you are in an international flight, and sit in the middle of 2 arabs in traditional attire, would you feel secure?, comfortable?, come on try and lie and tell us that you don't mind ... two words: BULL S.H.I.T.

Last Edited : Friday, 8 July 2005 - 09:52

"Causes of the blasts are not clear."-LOD

This thread is all around the world touching on everything from London and Balli, fighting the *blankety-blanks* to the bitter end and then on to conspiracies and how the US will be blamed not to mention hatred from the left and their joy every time we "mess up".
Well I'm not on the left but I felt like addressing/reiterating my ideas of how the problem should have been handled in Iraq, and I'm not advocating exterminating anyone;

but when a people prove themselves to be incorrigible basicly because of their beliefs, there is a need to cause a change in their way of thinking even if it means curtailing their basic freedoms by preventing them from being able to get near people they might like to harm;
So I wish the forum moderator would be allowed to be the one to decide that which is off topic, who certainly is himself IMO tending to touch on controversial subtopics.

PS:
IMO the comment by LOD above gave wide latitude to this thread and I too extend my sympathies to the people of London and the UK but I still think we put the "cart before the horse" in Iraq where a police state was necessary instead of "kid gloves" to control and cause a change in the way these people think.

TR

well i agree with the fackt that we should treat people as good or bad as they ackt not by where their from , who they are or were, or who their with. and no offance ameracans but your not exacly helping your making it worst. your going to all this contrys saying that their terrist and blowing them up .............. ive been lisoning arond and i have reson to belive that you are killing more inocents then you are terreist. .............. and just so were clear the meaning of terreist is not arab people. but people who cause pain in fear to some one else witch means any one can be a terreist i'm one when a freak out my sister on halloween ............... and right now america is being the terreist by going over to these contrys and blowing them up just because some people desighted to distroy the tween towers or what ever in america ............................. so just remeber anyone can be a terreist and please don't take this the wrong way.


N.H

Last Edited : Friday, 8 July 2005 - 10:32

Mog all you look at is the "wrongs", or really all you look "for" is anything that you don't agree with.

I didnt comment anything in this thread TR
That messege is pasted from cnn newsflash

Ok yes I see but the comment still gives wide latitude to this thread

TR

i didnt think this thread was about pointing out who was wrong or right but was here merely to pass on our apologies to our friends in london who have just come thru a horrible horrible experinece some of those british chaps have lost loved ones and some have suffered horrible injuries at the hands of the terrible bombers, which is what i thought Mr.Lod started this thread for I dont see where he made any comment I send all my prayers to the british people may they regroup and recover quickly from this.

Right you are RoyalHighness. I didnt start this thread to start a political quarrel. The victems deserve more respect than that I think....

Argh, actually i did post something this morning but something happened to my internet connection and nothing was posted!! Urgh.

Anyway, i`m tired of all those blaming made by you guys. Stop blaming anyone when you don't even have any tiny proof at all. It's like trying to give some answer to your own people using a lie-I`m refering to these countries attacked by terrorist. It seems so pathetic to make your citizens blame all this on the terrorist although it could be someone else-again refering to the leaders of these countries. Think about it,those who really did it will be laughing their ass off. Instead of blaming anyone(which i know you guys are just trying to vent off), why not cool down and let the authorities do their job and wait for a proper answer?...

Secondly, I`m extremely pissed with the accusation of eastern countries. If you said that eastern countries can't live without oil, then i would say that western countries can't live if there is no eastern countries. Come to think of it!...Who the hell gonna buy all the stuffs western countries made. What will happened if western countries lost all their industries. Doh! I`m not trying to retalling anyone here but i really felt offended with that statement. To be truth, we need each other. Eastern or western and all countries around the world. Western countries mostly were rich because they were just lucky. They were the earliest to use technique to gain land all over the world. They use bad tactics!...Remember?
Cheating of local`s land and stuffs. Thats if you really know the history of most countries around the world. They are kinda the first to actually use lie to develop! So stop telling people that eastern uses this and that to develop!...

Lastly, I`m only partly agree about the islamic thingy. Its not the fault of the religious. Its the people that practice those religion falsely! If you are saying that islam provoked war and stuffs-don't forget that christians involves too in the war at some river(didn't quite remember). By doing a comparation, accusing those that practice islam as stupid and stuffs because they believe in what they believe in-is like saying that those american armies that died in the war are stupid(I remember someone said something about do not insult those armies for believing in what they fight for). Its true that a lot of bad things happened in these islamic countries but its because they still haven't develop. In my country, I did admit most of these islam are just too stupid to think because they rely too much on what they believe is god. But no doubt that there are a those that use their brain to think. For instance our ex prime minister Dr Mahathir. I truly respect him for what he did and for what he is.
So don't chop down the whole apple tree because of one bad apple.

Soree for my bad english. I`m not really that good at explaning. Hope you guys get what i mean and soree to those that i offended just like when i felt offended.

I expressed my sympathies for the British people but the fact remains that the comment
"Causes of the blasts are not clear"
in the first post of this thread allowed a contribution from someone that the bombings were "inspired by Al-Qaida" and a whole lot of other information followed by the idea that the blame would fall on us (i.e. the USA) followed by another comment that the left just loves when we mess up;

and that was followed by me adding that I admit that I'm not happy the way we handled Iraq because I don't like our troops being killed by car bombs while standing on sentry duty;
but I don't see anywhere mentioned where we are expected to apologize for the tragedy in London. I'm certainly sorry for all those who have suffered because of the tragedy but apologize means to extend regrets for wrong doing and I do believe that it reopens the sub-topic of who to blame.

TR

i don't think anyone is trying to acuse anyone of anything i think they just simply whant to make a point. yes it's sad that london has been ataked but i still don't understand why evryone is so quick to blame the eastern contrys it could be any one it could even be a canadian
that did it............... i'm not trying to blame anyone in canada i just simply pointed out that you don't have to be arab to be a terreist it could be anyone........ it might not even be al quada or whatever his names is. i think mabe it would be better if instade of going to a contry like afganastan and start killing evry one just because they have a different goverment then the u.s.a they should go and find these people that are doing this and put them to jail in stade of mindlessly killing everyone they belive are terreist.

The people who run these countries are HELPING the terrorist. They won't allow us to just go and get them. We asked that the Taliban turn Bin Laden over to us, they refused.

ok but theres no reson to kill evry arab in the world for that

OK, I agree this thread has gone far off topic. We have expressed our sadness about the bombings in London. Perhaps this thread could now be closed and another started to talk about who did what to whom.

I apologize if I took the thread so far off topic.

Londoners are a hardened sort. During the 2000 years the city existed there have been many atrocities commited and many deeds of terror made. Attacks on them has always only made them fight more determined. No terrorgroup will ever bend the will to fight in the Londoncommunity.
I close this thread here, ensured of that, that attack was the beginning of the end for the ones committing it.

Since the thread is still open...

I will take this opportunity to agree with LOD's assessment of the British in general and Londoners specifically. This will not turn out well for the terrorists.

My prayers are with the families of the innocent victims of this tragic despicable attack.
H.

S.h.i.t... have you heard the newest news (sorry for the cacophony).

I belive it was CIA's work ... darn USA, it was all planned by this crazy coke head bush ... well but it is just a theory, we think ... when they finish working on not finding the plane in the pentagon they will finish clarifing this.

Oh, brother!!!

The CIA???? Not the martians? I don't believe it. Have you seen War of the Worlds yet?

So where is the plane that didn't really hit the Pentagon? Is it in Mexico with you guer? If so, please release Mrs Olson...she is a really super lady.
Thanks,
H.