I was one of the original "ultra advocates" but I didn't ever play them because they are "unranked". Well I have learned that some people believe that there must be "interest before some folks will make an effort", while other people believe that "when some folks make an effort they become interested";
and now I'm sure that both ideas have merit because I have finally involved myself in an "Ultra" for both reasons (i.e. because I was always interested in them and once I made an effort to play an "Ultra" I became "ultra interested").

However,
as much as I'm enjoying playing an "Ultra campaign" I have literally "passed out" at least twice from lack of sleep in the past three days to play it and I suggest that "Ultras" should be offered FASTER so that they can be played out in a day or two but also at **4 hour turns** like the beginner games for folks who like the fast pace but can't stay at the computer non-stop for 3 to 5 days.

TR

TR- What are you suggesting?

A 4 hour turn ultra that can give you somewhat of a break between turns to catch a nap? You need sleep?? (j/k)
That would be good.

I personally like the faster suggestion better. What should the turn length be? Maybe 30 min. turns? That should keep the action flowing non-stop By the time you move/build/buy/attack/deploy it'll be time to start all over again. Or even 15 min. turns...you'll just have to be quick!

A 15 min. turn length will make it feel as if you were playing a 'live' board game, and yield 96 turns in a 24 hr. period. A 120 turn game would be over in 30 hours. The victory would/could go to the person that can make every turn move. It would only be for the dedicated for sure!
But if you could line it up ahead of time with 9 other players, imagine the fun of a 10 player game moving that fast

I like it! Good suggestion TR

Last Edited : Sunday, 20 March 2005 - 09:28

Thanks "B-W",
and yes ... I'm going into turn 62 of a 5 player "Ultra" with about 10 hours sleep over about 4 days and I don't want to stop.

TR

A new turn every 15 minutes -- I like that. But it would probably have to be limited to a small map with a max of 6 players.

It could be called a "marathon" game.

Well it has been a "marathon" and our game that we are playing now could probably be finished in a few more hours with a tick every 15 or 20 minutes so that I can get a fresh start.

TR

why not add a feature like the "quit the game earlier", when ALL players have to accept.

For the choosing of the lenght of game turns.

I give an example... I'm playing 3 beg games, 1 at a pace of 6h and the rest at 12h.
Since I'm learning... it's ok, but the thing is, whenever i go to work i miss 1 or 2 turns on the 6h, and if i stay a bit with my gf (big grin), i'll lose one on the others.

So my sugestion is... while everyone has the time... all players could be playing at 15m turns... and if someone needed to go out for some reason, work or else, could ask the other players to change to 6h or 12h, or even 4h...

This would mean that people could play fast when available... and NOT lose turns, and find that he was "killed" on the game, just because he went to work or some other emergency happened to him.

What do You all think?

Well I think it's a good idea and I suggested something like it a long time ago (i.e. I suggested an agreed 8 hour break that could be set where players agree to set it and even possibly rotate it) but the problem is that folks live in different time zones and it would be very difficult for players to agree on a fair time adjustment.

Players would rightly always feel that the element of luck is too great a factor (i.e. e.g. the game got slowed or stopped when I was free and made fast when I'm at work or usually sleeping).
Anyway if the game is just made to tick every 15 or 20 minutes and also another game is made to tick every 4 hours, the conditions are the same for all who play it except of course for players who just are unable to play fast games.

TR

How about if instead of the current "Games available" structure, there were a game "lobby". An individual could set up a game based on a varying set of parameters, such as:

-- A given starting date/time *OR* when all queued up
-- # of players
-- Allowable player levels
-- Clan restrictions, if any
-- Map (with ability to add new ones with the editor)
-- nn Minutes per turn
-- nn minutes of break every nn turns, or a pause feature that allows "rounds" (e.g. each Saturday morning could be a round)
-- Medieval, Demonic, etc.
-- Max damage or not

Then people could join or queue up as they desire.

I think that programing issues could/would be a big factor in setting up either a 'game lobby' with adjustable game requirements or a game that had varying turn times within the same game. I'm sure it could be done, but I believe Req would rather focus his energy on getting the new version out. That is just my opinion, of course, and might be totally off base

Setting an ultra game to have a 15 min. turn length should be a fast and easy thing for Req to accomplish if he so chose to, with all other game features remaining the same.

that's just my 2 cents...for what it's worth

iznogoud- If time is a problem for you in 6 hr, and sometimes 12 hr. games...then when you start playing the regular campaign games, try out the 24 hr. games. 1 turn a day should let you work, spend some time with your honey, and let you make your game moves without missing any turns.

Is anyone playing the timed battles?

Ok
Here is another possible option that I think I mentioned for the ranked games. Granted it might not be so easy to get a full game of players who are able to play a "non-stop action ultra campaign" and that's why a 5 player game seems to me more practical for this, but how about if the game started at a 2 hour or even a 4 hour pace and then when it gets down to just 2 players left, they have the option to vote to put the game in "fast-play mode".

Let's face it ... "Req" allowed these games because even guys who can't play them non-stop wanted them, but they are "unranked" because of that;
and there is a very strong likelyhood that the last two players standing in these "Ultra's" may be most likely the players who can complete the most turns;

but not necessarily so, if players are able to gain the necessary basic techs early and then always maintain a good defensive posture while budgeting carefully timed appearances, I think some of our experts might still rise to the top.

In any event though, if two opponents at the end are well matched at there ability to endure a "marathon" type "non-stop ultra", why not give them the option to vote to put the game in "high gear" so they can get it done probably at that stage in less than a day.

PS:
This sounds quite similar to "Izno's" idea but I do think I did suggest this for the "ranked" games and it is a little different also.
Something else to consider is that many players who are unable to play "Ultras" now would be able to play them on the weekends if they were able to be completed in a day or two.

TR

Last Edited : Monday, 21 March 2005 - 09:29

What about having short, 10 minute campaigns with only about 40 turns or so that can be played in one afternoon? That way, people who have a few hours and then have to go away can play a quick campaign, without loosing because they can't play for the last turns.

Well I just finished a game with "Luger" that lasted just under 70 turns so I would go along with an 80 turn "Ultra". Some of these new techs just require a longer game or they can't be had IMO.

TR

Just as a point to ponder, it may be difficult to make a game that has turns update at a point other than on the hour.

All other games update each hour, and this MAY (obviously I didn't write the code, so I could be COMPLETELY wrong here) be a limitation of turn generation.

Basically this would mean if you wanted to shorten the turns, your basement would be 1 hour.

5 hour turn would be best. I have school, and I need to sllep a teensy bit, you know?

Well "Req" has made some mention of that "Genghis" but I think he said something about having to keep the hours even (i.e. two hours, four hours, six hours, and so forth) but he has also discussed ticks that divide the hour as a base into "15 minute and 30 minute ticks".

If you guys plug the word "ticks" into the forum search, under "Suggestions" you will find a thread "new quick campaign" where we have discussed this idea before (i.e. without any attention from "Req") and in another thread entitled "Combat Issue from Balancing Thread" where "Req" makes mention of "15 and 30 minute combat ticks";
So apparently at least "15 or 30 minute ticks" are possible.

TR

PS:
Anyway to repeat ... I am of the opinion after playing an "Ultra" that I enjoyed immensely, that they can be even better if they are made much faster (i.e. 2 to 4 ticks/hr or even 3 ticks/hr) and/or also reduced in speed to 4 hour turns like "beginner games".

The result would be that the faster game could be played by many more who do not play them because the game would be playable to completion during a weekend as opposed to taking as long or longer than 5 days to complete now and because those 5 days are quite a strain on players due to a lack of sleep, a game with 4 hour turns would at least allow a few hours sleep between turns, but and also probably be more convenient for more players to play;

So this proposed change shouldn't be any more advantageous for frequent onliners than at present and really Less So, Plus allow more players to be able to play them;
and I'm still NOT trying to get them ranked, although maybe I can design an "Ultra Trophy" for us too.

TR

But a faster ultra should also have a SET starting time instead of waiting to start when all players are queued up. Otherwise, someone is very likely to miss the first few key hours of the game (up to 12 turns!?). Maybe even get tossed for inactivity!

For example, since the 15th turn or so of Ultra 2, it became a 6-player game because 14 players were booted from inactivity. It would have been better to start with the 6 active players when they were queued up instead of waiting (and waiting) to get 20 queued up and then have 14 get dropped. Right now, those 20-player ultra slots are pretty much just a waste of space because of this issue.

Max- It WOULD be nice to be able to complete a game in a long afternoon. I think that's a wondeful suggestion. 10 hours needed to complete a 40 turn game with 15 min. turns, but TR makes a valid point about being able to have/use the higher techs/troops in such a short-turned game. Could that be avoided by either decreasing the costs of purchases, or increasing the income/resources generated per turn, or even a combination of the two? Then add the ability to buy two techs per turn instead of one and I think you'd still see cats, HC, knights and the like at game end like current games. Not sure how hard it would be to code it...

Luger- You also have a VERY valid point with how the game would start. Perhaps a message indicating the start time for turn 0 could be sent to all players, and the start time would ALWAYS be 10:00-game clock(just a randow time-could be made whatever) the following day instead of based on when the last person queued. You might still lose one here or there, but if people ONLY queued if they were serious about participating, then everyone should still be able to get going on turn 0/1 ok.

Another option would be to have different games based on where you live. You could chose marathon ultra-USA, marathon ultra-UK, marathon ultra-Japan, etc. so that everyone participating basically lives in close to the same time zone. That way one person isn't having to stay up all night to play while another is just killing a lazy afternoon. Have the games start early morning/noon time for the specific time zone selected. Hope that makes sense, but again, don't know about the coding.

"B_W"
As far as I'm concerned, they are all good ideas that you propose but a campaign just can't be only 40 turns.
It's just not "epicurean".
Seriously with the changes you propose, I'll compromise to a 60 turn "marathon ultra" but for now I'll be happy if "Req" can just give us a faster tick "marathon ultra" and a slower tick "plain ol' ultra".

PS:
"Requiem" ... please ... if you can hear me ...
Again please ... if you can give us a
*3 or 4 tick/hour* "marathon ultra"
and also a *4 tick/4 hour* "plain ol' ultra"
at 60 to 80 turns for either or both of them,
I believe a very large number of us will be able to play them at least on the weekends and I think a very large number of us will be very happy for it.

Can we have a poll for a "show of hands" on this?

TR